The Reality Method 2.0

How to succeed with women, actually, for real…and for free.
March 15th, 2007

The Hot Guy Scale (Social Value Theory)

I got on the street car today to go to the store, and instantly noticed something that I see quite a lot in this city, and in this country in general…

A not-so-cute girl (maybe a 6.5) with a really good looking guy.

Now, I’m not gay, but I can tell if another guy is good-looking enough to be considered “attractive” or not by the opposite sex. I think most guys can tell this, too, even if they don’t admit it to themselves.

Anyway, immediately upon seeing this happy, lovely Hot-Guy-with-Not-Girl couple, I shook my head inwardly. I see it all the time; but I still feel let down every time. You can do better I silently think at the guy’s head. I don’t care how good the girl is in bed, or how great her personality is, or how funny or talented she is (though God only knows what that means), if she’s not physically attractive at a certain minimum level, she’s not relationship material.

Guys forget this all the time, or never understand it to begin with, and therefore get into relationships with girls that aren’t good enough for them, making the mistake of comparing their own self-perceived “value” on a 1-to-1 basis with the “total package” of girls value, not just their looks.

I’ve made this mistake. Hell, when I started getting laid, this was the only mistake I made consistently: I look back at my first string of girls, and while they all had “interesting personalities”, most were downright fugly. In fact, I got to thinking about it today, and out of the first 10 girls I laid, there were probably only 1 or 2 that would be considered traditionally “hot” (i.e. 7’s).

Which brings me to the topic at hand, Social Value Theory: how it functions in male-female interactions, and why forgetting it will land you in a relationship with girls who aren’t hot enough for you.

What Social Value Theory Says

SVT is very simple. It basically says this:

In terms of dating and sex, guys are measured on very different criteria than women. Women are measured based on their looks. Full stop, period. Guys are measured on the strength of their personalities and character, and all the accessories and accouterments they can garner as a result of their personalities and character.”

That’s it. That’s the whole kit and caboodle right there.

In what is easily the most-popular article I’ve written thus far (at least in these first three months of having this site up) I put down a concrete measurement scale for women purely based on their looks; and I’ve gone on and also said that maybe we should consider other factors, since women are complex; but ultimately I think we as men know that the vast majority of the determination of our “value” of a woman is on looks.

This is just not the case for guys. So I guess this post can be considered the Hot Dude Scale, because in the next paragraphs I will lay out exactly what it is that makes men attractive (and therefore valuable and desirable) to women.

What Creates ‘Value’ For a Man?
This shouldn’t be too hard to figure out, right? We already have a solid understanding of what we as men value in women: body symmetry, healthy-looking skin, proportionate hips and breasts, childlike facial features with big eyes, slim waist, long legs…all these things, especially when put together in one “package” in one woman, create a “valuable” woman that we rate as higher in value than a woman who, for instance, is short and tubby, has square masculine features, is overweight, and walks with a limp because one leg is longer than the other.

Similarly, there are a number of things that “create value” for men.

In no particular order:

(1) Their self-confidence. Key.
(2) Their social status and position. (High or low? Leader or follower?)
(3) Their ability to create rapport and vibe (social skills).
(4) Their level of life experience (perspective).
(5) Their drive and motivation (where are they going?) or, if they’re older:
(6) Their accomplishments (real world, concrete stuff).

That’s a pretty exhaustive list. Everything else that is considered “attractive” by seducers of all stripes can be fit somewhere in that list: for example, “being sexual, not horny” = I consider that part of self-confidence. “Be mysterious” I consider part of social skills. “Being the prize” and “be alpha” = again, self-confidence. “Show her that you’re safe” = part of rapport. “Be different from all the other guys” = social status. “Show her you understand her” = rapport and vibing.

I could go on, but I think I’ve made the point. There’s maybe those 6 fundamental categories that create value for men; they may be labeled slightly differently elsewhere, but it’s the same stuff underneath.

So let’s use those 6 categories to create a hypothetical Perfect “10″ of Male value, just like we did above with women.

He would have to be:

(1) Extremely self-confident: not cocky, but confident, owing to all his past success and his own demonstrable prowess in many different areas of life. Imagine Richard Branson type self-confidence.

(2) Extremely socialized and sociable; able to talk to just about anyone, anywhere, about anything, under any circumstances, regardless of social pressure. Bonus points if he speaks more than one (or two, or three) languages.

(3) Able to create an almost instantaneous feeling of “incredible connection” with a woman, just from speaking to her for a few minutes. Perceived as really opening up and listening and communicating on a deep, soulful level if appropriate.

(4) Has many, varied, interesting, entertaining, shocking, dangerous, fascinating life experiences in his past, that have helped shape who he is, and perhaps more importantly, lives a life that opens him to varied, interesting, entertaining, shocking, etc new experiences. A guy who loves learning will always be higher value than a stick-in-the-mud.

(5) Has drive, motivation and goals and (6) accomplishments: a perfect “10″ would either an older guy with experience (see #4) and lots of accomplishments under his belt who is still pushing on to bigger and better things, or a younger up-and-comer on the make who is really going to make it big. They’re equally attractive in a woman’s eyes.

NOTE: If you don’t believe young up-and-comers can be as sexy to women as older established “proven” successes, talk to my good friend Angela. She had a huge crush on a very popular well-known rock star for a while, even going to his concerts, meeting him backstage, drawing him pictures and so forth. She was literally dripping for this guy and probably had a chance to fuck him (he was responding quite well to her).

Then, several months later, she got involved with a guy who was a few grades behind her in high school — total comedown, right? But he happens to be an insanely talented vocalist and musician, a guy who can probably legitimately get record deals and make it big.

Notice the transition and value comparison: one guy, already a rock star, much older: another guy, much younger (younger even than her), a nobody, but a nobody with real talent, who hasn’t blown up yet. The only significant difference is it’s easier for her to “get in on the ground floor” of a good thing than break in to an established circle of groupies.

The male analogue would be fucking a rural girl who doesn’t know how hot she is yet.

The Most Important Part of the SVT is Not Included
Take a second and go back and re-read the list of 6 categories above. Look carefully, and see if you can spot something that is conspicuous for its absence. Got it? Good. Here it is:

PHYSICAL APPEARANCE DOES NOT APPEAR ANYWHERE ON THE LIST IN ANY FORM!

Of course women like it when guys look good. Of course women like the V-taper, and the good body symmetry, and the well-developed muscles, and the good teeth, and a light tan, and strong legs, etc etc.

But to women these things are like a bonus. As long as a guy is not HIDEOUSLY DISFIGURED, he can be any size, any shape….and if the 6 categories above are all in place (or even mostly in place, or even one of them is in place way more solidly than it is in most guys) he WILL GET LAID.

I’ve had girls even tell me this flat-out: “Guys looks don’t matter. I’d rather he was intelligent.” I’ve also had girls tell me, “It’s so disappointing…I’ll see a hot guy and be all excited, and then he comes and sits down and starts talking, and as soon as he opens his mouth he starts saying the stupidest boring things. It’s such a let down.”

They don’t care what a guy looks like. Absolutely DO NOT CARE. The 6 components of the SVT are far, far more important in their determination of whether they will sleep with a guy than looks.

The Strength of SVT
The above section on looks is how Social Value Theory also, incidentally, predicts not only why “hot” (high value) guys are often seen with uglier girls, but why “ugly” (physically unattractive) guys are often seen with the HOTTEST women: because those men knew that their PHYSICAL looks didn’t matter, and also knew that their actual SOCIAL values in those categories were high enough that they started demanding hotter women for themselves.

SVT also correctly predicts that many of the things that guys obsess over getting, the external status symbols that many guys think are actually responsible for them getting women, are important only inasmuch as they suggest that the guy has social value.

For instance, in stands to reason that a guy who is motivated, self-confident, and socially skilled would climb the corporate ladder, maybe even make a good manager, or perhaps, having courage (self-confidence) and ingenuity (part of drive and motivation), be an entrepreneur that starts a multi-million dollar business.

As a result of these qualities he has, he becomes wealthy and buys himself a Rolex watch and a Mercedes-Benz.

Now. Those status symbols are NOTHING without the social value that were responsible for the guy being able to afford them. But many, many guys chase after these symbols AS THOUGH the symbols are what the value inheres in.

But in fact nothing could be further from the truth: the value inheres in the man who has the power, the value, to warrant the symbols. The symbols are just symptomatic.

Some Eastern philosophers have put it this way:

In the West, the problem is that people think that when they HAVE certain things, then they can finally DO that which will allow them to BE who they desire to be.

In the East, the idea is first to BE who you are, which will naturally lead you to DO certain things, which will finally lead to the result that you HAVE certain things.

The pertinent example: guys think that if they HAVE a fancy car and expensive clothes, they will DO better with women, and therefore suddenly BE a player and realize all their fantasies.

Do you see how absurd that logic is?

The presence or absence of a fancy car or expensive clothes has NOTHING TO DO with your skill at interacting with women.

The Eastern way, on the other hand, would call for a guy simply to BE who he is, which might lead him to DO more to improve his interactions with women, which in turn would result in him HAVING all sorts of great sexual adventures as he becomes more and more skilled.

That’s it. Social value theory predicts it and illustrates; Eastern philosophy simplifies and validates it.

That’s the simplest, most direct explanation of not only how to be successful in this Game, but how to be successful in the Game of Life.

15 Responses to “The Hot Guy Scale (Social Value Theory)”

  1. Sadly, women are overpriced and men are undervalued these days…

  2. There is a massively important factor that you have omitted to take into account… relativity.

    For example, you could be the best looking guy in the room, or the worst looking. It depends on all the other guys in that room. I can be the oldest or the youngest, the fattest or the thinnest — because everything and every perception is related to a comparative and moving benchmark.

    A player will know within a few minutes the “temperature” or a room, and either stay to hit on women or else leave to try somewhere more favourable to him.

    Even if you have all the attributes you mentioned, it counts for nothing if the gal cannot avail herself of the information — so in a room of loud music where chit chat is impossible, how can you be witty, confident and so forth — she has to be going on looks in that particular room.

    Finally, people are compared with other people across time and place — so you may be compared with her ex all the time, or with someone she fancies at work.

    As I said it’s all relative.

    Your early conquests may have been the best girls available to you, and in that room at that time, you were exotic, fresh new meat or you compared favourably with the locals.

    Getting a sense of context is the secret to it all, believe me. Suddenly you know when and where to even bother.

  3. Rtone,

    While I agree that context and knowing your venue is very important, I don’t agree with your overall gist. What you’re alluding to here is the level of difficulty you’re going to have in a given venue, depending on your skill level and social value. If you walk into an exclusive bar filled with Mafioso, movie producers, and rock stars, the bar is much, much, harder to pull from, yes — but with a strong enough skill set and internal value, even that stiff level of competition won’t make staying a “waste of time”.

    Truth be told, the best guys in this field have regularly pulled model-hot girls out from under rock stars, movie producers, attractive actors, and other traditionally “high-status” guys.

    As to comparisons across time or people. It’s true that a lot of women will have different plates in the air at one time, and that others compare new guys to their exes (we all do that to an extent). But the idea that this comparison is going to make a seduction so difficult that it would be better off not to even try? I think that’s just laziness.

    I am as guilty as any guy of going into an environment knowing that my status and position *in that specific venue* will make it very easy for me to play and win.Sometimes you just wanna shoot fish in a barrel with a 12-gauge. But I don’t do it all the time, nor should ANY guy….it makes your social muscles weak.

  4. Hi,
    Straight from a girl, these are the (obvious) things that make a guy attractive:
    1. Looks, as much as you say they don’t matter, believe me, they do. however, they matter in direct proportion to how well the points below are met. I.e. if the guy is really rich, then expectations for good looks slip a little, but not so much that a girl will settle for a really average looking guy (unless they themselves are average too).
    2.Being reasonably successful, that is, employed in a similar level or higher (preferably) position than the woman in question. They do not have to be mega rich to be attractive, but unemployment or a really lowly job is not attractive.
    3.Not arrogant or cocky but confident and takes the lead (masculine). Also, this leads to the importance of being thoughtful, respectful and gentlemanly/chivalrous as well.
    5. Be older than the woman in question.
    6. Be reasonably intelligent and able to partake in interesting conversation.
    7. Have good hands and nails. Well, this last one might not be important to all girls, but to me, its essential : )!

    Finally, remember guys, the LEAST attractive thing you can do is treat women with no respect and as conquests. I know the thing that turns me off guys is when they hang around in packs and intimidate women. And don’t whistle at women. Honestly, we hate that. We really do.

  5. Hi Evie, thanks for your female perspective.

    However, I want to make a few comments on your comments:

    First, straight from the article:

    “Of course women like it when guys look good. Of course women like the V-taper, and the good body symmetry, and the well-developed muscles, and the good teeth, and a light tan, and strong legs, etc etc…..

    But to women these things are like a bonus. As long as a guy is not HIDEOUSLY DISFIGURED, he can be any size, any shape….and if the 6 categories above are all in place (or even mostly in place, or even one of them is in place way more solidly than it is in most guys) he WILL GET LAID.”

    Your point #3 is correct. The highest quality women do need to be treated well. Treated well does NOT equal worshipping them and allowing yourself to be too swayed by their charms. The really attractive man is always in charge.

    Point #5….plenty of older women go for younger guys. And not just cougars. You just can’t generalize this much (I know, I know, coming from me….)

    Point #6…I now begin to wonder if leaving out intelligence was a mistake. Intelligence is INCREDIBLY SEXY to women. It’s part of dominance. If you’re smarter than a girl, you can fuck her. If she’s smarter than you….SHE’ll be fucking YOU…but only if she wants to.

    Your final point about “respecting” women….in some cultures women LOVE being whistled at. They won’t admit it, but they love it. Again, it’s great to have a female opinion on here every now and again, but you can’t possibly believe you are speaking for ALL women “WE hate that…WE really do”. You are doing many of your fellow women a disservice by putting words in their mouths here.

  6. Appearance matters A LOT to girls - make no mistake. But only a part of this is physical looks (which you can’t really change). The rest is style (which you CAN). And if anything, style can often trump physical looks for women…

  7. Women are not attracted to men who are good looking, they are attracted to men who are attractive.
    Big difference!
    You don’t have to be impressive… you just have to be interesting!
    ———
    The above is from Zan, and I’ve noticed to be true. When I’ve acted in an attractive way, I’ve gotten with a model-esque chick. But if I don’t act like I’m attractive, women don’t approach me. You ladies get my point.

  8. You seem very insistent on the point that looks don’t matter if you’re a guy but the fact is, looks are quite an important factor to girls. Girls are picky and will consider everything! Of course a woman will want a man who is a good provider but not at the cost of having her children turn out ugly. Personality and ambition can be shaped (remember, girls will try to mold you once they have you in a relationship) but your DNA is a fundamental.

  9. To girl1’s comments:

    Remember, guys, the #1 cardinal rule of this stuff:

    1) what girls think they want
    2) are willing to admit to wanting
    and
    3) actually want

    are three entirely different things.

  10. I think looks matter in relation to how well you have that other stuff down.
    Naturally, if you either have or can fake Items #1-6 you don’t have to be attractive to pull hot women. I knew a basically unattractive guy in college who had items #1 & #3 and could fake the rest pretty well. He was always pulling hot women.

    Women are basically more willing to trade-off looks for other qualities then men are. In their value equation, looks have a much lower weighting.

    That being said, I’ve only met a few guys in my life that have #1-#6 down so well that it would be able to overcome any serious deficiencies in looks.

  11. One more thing. The reason that the really good looking guy is only with a 6.5 is because he probably doesn’t have 1-6 in check.

  12. I want to agree with everything here, but I’d like to point something out:

    Yes, occasionally you do see a hot babe with a much uglier guy, although for me, I almost never see this.

    I think the reason you will see good looking guys with not-as-good looking girls is that these guys prefer a girl who is “easy” and hassle-free, maybe she worships him and he doesn’t have to work so hard.

    The real point I want to make is that if you take any couple you know who has been together for a while, what I have found is that in every single case, they are of approximately equal physical attractiveness.

    So I guess my point is that while everything here is valid, I would argue about the fact that the physical attractiveness of a man is still important to women. It may be a base level from which the other factors of attraction are built.

  13. Wow. Just reading over these comments, I can see what a hard sell it is to convince most people that for guys, “looks don’t matter.”

    I know, I know. It’s a hard pill to swallow. Girls don’t want to admit that this stuff is true, and that even the hottest girl can be attracted from a cold approach, 0 to fuck-me, in a matter of minutes even by a guy who is nowhere near as “physically hot” as she is.

    And guys don’t want to stop making excuses for their own lack of success. “It’s all those hot guys, THEY’Ve got all the hot girls! It’s only natural! They’re more similar in value! If only my teeth were fixed, or my pecs were bigger, or I lost some weight, then maybe, MAYBE I could get a halfway decent girl…until then, it’s not even worth trying…..”

    Trust me guys, I used to be one of you, saying that same shit. Those are all just excuses you’re making for yourselves.

    You don’t have to believe me, but I am telling you the truth.

  14. I agree 100% with what you’re saying. Women could care less about physical looks as long as the other factors are present. I’m not sure that men have problems dealing with this because they are looking for excuses though. I just think that men’s minds are so geared toward physical attraction that it just goes against their biological nature to understand anything differnent. The same goes for women who will never understand men because it goes against their very nature. We’re nothing more then evolutionary robots who live very predictable lives from birth to death. All GENERALLY going through the same life phases, etc…Most of what you say is spot on, -but it’s not rocket science. But it insults peoples sensiblities because nobody wants to admit we’re no better then salmom swimming upsteam to perform natures grand intentions. We people just have minds that have to deny realities becuase we cannot think objectively about ourselves. As Neitche wrote: “Love is the sexual excitment of the young, the habituation of the middle age, and the co-dependency of the old”, and if you think about it, could it not be more naturally perfect this way.

  15. Overall I thought it was a good article. I know a lot of guys that think looks are more important than they actually are. What’s interesting is that there seems to be a fundamental attribution error among guys. That is, unattractive guys frequently attribute the success of good looking guys to their looks and attractive guys frequently attribute their success to factors that have nothing to do with their looks.

    What does not seem to be mentioned in the article, however, is that guys looks are often a *reflection* of the 5 or 6 categories that you mention. I’m sure this is something that you fully understand but to be fair women can deduce a man’s confidence based on his body language alone. As Doc in Cliff’s List 2005 said it’s about a man’s look and not his lookS.

    This is an interesting topic and is something that I’ll certainly write more on as I develop my blog.

    –Fashion